Comments on: Replace Algebra with … Algebra?

By: Ihor charischak

Ihor charischak — Tue, 16 Oct 2012 17:53:53 +0000

Now we can agree to agree. Thanks, for the response. You are definitely one of the “good guys.” I love your work.

By: MrHonner

MrHonner — Sat, 13 Oct 2012 02:00:58 +0000

Ihor-

I apologize if my remarks put you on the defensive. I tend to see the “Is Algebra Necessary?” episode in the context of the larger public smear campaign against teachers, schools, and public education in general. As such, thinking about it can fire me up a bit.

I understand the challenges facing math education. I’m not sure I would advocate that every student be required to take an “algebra” course, per se. But I do think every student should be consistently exploring ideas quantitatively as part of their education. That will necessarily entail learning, and doing, some algebra.

By: Ihor charischak

Ihor charischak — Sat, 13 Oct 2012 01:29:31 +0000

With all due respect my comment was intended for Mr. Bombastic. I think we have come to closure about this issue. My position is that I disagree with you on your assessment of the value of teaching traditional algebra to everyone and allowing only the experts to make that decision. Hacker is no dummy and his opinion should be respected. Again with all due respect if most teachers were as gifted as you are I wouldn’t even bring up the issue becuase then kids wouldn’t hate math as much as they do. Again, my only point is that algebra should not determine whether a student can proceed into higher education. There have to be other first class options for those students who view algebra only as impediment. Couldnt they get the kind of crticial thinking skills that supposedly algebra gives (and BTW there is no research that says definitely that it does) in ways that are more interesting to the student?

By: MrHonner

MrHonner — Fri, 12 Oct 2012 18:25:34 +0000

I care about Hacker’s qualifications. Public dialogue about teaching is largely dominated by people who have limited, or in some cases, no experience teaching.

Hacker’s editorial is yet another such example. Hacker does not know what algebra is. He is another non-expert framing and driving dialogue in education. This general trend is having a negative impact on schools, teachers, and ultimately students.

There are serious issues with math education, and important discussions to be had. Let’s strive for experts to lead these discussions.

By: Ihor charischak

Ihor charischak — Fri, 12 Oct 2012 16:54:55 +0000

Who cares whether Hacker is knowledgeable or not in all things algebra? He raises a legimitate question that I think that the more knowledgeable math community should not ignore that for most kids algebra is a waste of time. You are right what currently passes for algebra should be an optional course. The only subject that is important is the everyday math that Keith Devlin refers to. And if someone wants to take algebra at a future time more power to them. To me algebraic thinking is the kind of thinking you need to do to solve algebra problems. To learn how to do real world thinking you can do that through other subjects as you suggest.

By: mr bombastic

mr bombastic — Thu, 02 Aug 2012 01:32:24 +0000

Agreed. I am not sure whether what currently passes for algebra should be required of all students, but Hacker did not come across as knowledgable of, well, anything in the article.

By: MrHonner

MrHonner — Thu, 02 Aug 2012 00:44:45 +0000

It doesn’t seem to me like he really put much thought into it; could be he felt obligated to offer up some “solution” in order to balance his opinion piece out. In the end, it’s just another recycled idea in a piece full of them.

Regardless of whether the ideas are any good, I don’t understand why he should be considered knowledgeable on the matter.

By: MrHonner

MrHonner — Thu, 02 Aug 2012 00:35:37 +0000

I’m glad to be part of sparking your outburst! Sounds like you’ve got your own response to write. Let me know when you post it.

By: mr bombastic

mr bombastic — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 23:56:41 +0000

Not quite sure what Hacker envisions for the CPI unit. I am guessing a spreadsheet with prices for different time periods and cells for weights that serve as variables. You could tinker around with the weights and see how the index is affected; do some research on why particular items are selected; select items and weights for a teenager CPI and see how well it compares to the actual CPI; etc. This may be a good use of time in a math class, but it could just as easily be done in a social studies class, and I don’t really think of this sort of thing as algebra. Seems more like computation to me, even though variables are involved.

Also, I am not at all opposed to integrating non-math topics into math class, but why is it such a one way street? Can’t Hacker just call for social studies teachers to do this sort of thing in their classes and make math optional?

By: MrHonner

MrHonner — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 20:45:54 +0000

The author doesn’t understand what algebra is, or what’s taught in schools. This is not a minor vocabulary issue. This is a fundamental lack of understanding of the very topic he purports to be expert in.

He argues that algebra is unnecessary; then he proposes an “alternative” which he doesn’t recognize as an algebra problem. He refers to AP Statistics as a “backdoor” algebra class; it is not. He seems to believe that someone could really understand statistics or finance without understanding algebra; they could not.

Whatever the “issues” are, I don’t see why he should be speaking prominently about them.